Deception and Danger in Satanland

[SOD of the CoE]

50041205 viii om

Hail Satan!
Father of Lies? oh Mahakala isn't the Father of Lies.
nor is Dramabog, I think. they're not Ahriman.

"Tani Jantsang" <***@SPAMpost.com>:
# ...ALL of the libel thrown my way (including Phil is a paperboy,
# I had kids when I was a teen, and a few other notable things I
# told specific people) are little astute LIES I told
# Gilmore/Nadramia when they tried to nose in.

yow, and then Walter was caught lying too.

# So I know exactly WHERE that originated from....

thanks for identifying them and their source (you).

# ...the rumors start at the source - PRECISELY where I put
# the DISinformation. Viola!

this may be the basis of complaint from Doug/Kori: deceit.

# ...I literally do not hold MYSELF down to any dogma.
# So I find it curious that people into chaos and anarchy
# get upset by that, LMAO. I guess they don't like real
# chaos when it concerns MY PERSONAL opinions. Hmm!
# And I remember the anarchist I knew that freaked out
# when me and my cousins did uh... oooops - online. No no.

it gives the impression that you are inconsistent, but you
don't seem to mind that much. without integrity, sometimes
people think you may be a danger to yourself or others, or
that your interests in manipulation with disinformation is
intended to sow disruption or infighting (divide/conquer?).

# ...certain people .... fit the bill .... I call them drones.
# They say the same things, repeatedly, build on them in the
# same way and so forth. Drones. I'm not the only person that
# came on here out of the blue and read it all (ALL), and
# NOTICED it....

quite so. I remember the 1996-7 Satanist-Neopagan Rumble. that
was the first time I think that "Tani-drones" were mentioned,
by the editor of the newsgroup FAQ, Lupo le Boucher. we even
got out the meme-spray and there were Form-Letter Tani-responses.
it was a hoot.

# ...Gilmore told me Aquino wrote most of ["The Satanic Rituals"]

thanks for the clarification. you explained again elsewhere.

# for over two fucking years - no, actually since before the 9/11
# bombing even, even before that!....

you seem to have been thinking about that event quite a bit lately.

# ...Do you think I was ever stupid? Do you think I ever trusted
# people who up front, day one, GAVE ME personal information,
# overt lies too, about their enemies that was given to them in
# confidence?? )

hey I know what you're saying (even though you were responding to
Kori, you put my previous ('maiden') name on it :>). I had similar
experiences and exposure in the OTO, where I received mixed
information from some of the people on the ground, but more or
less the straight dirt from my direct correspondence with one or
more officers in the order. the disinformation or misunderstanding,
as it occurred, had a tendency to be confusing and sometimes it
favoured the speaker, or made it seem more difficult to engage
the org than it was. eventually I sorted that out and initiated.

# ...Tim [was] indimidated and threatened because he wanted to
# collect good essays on "Is Fascism Satanic"?

strange, that. I hope CoS answers for it somehow. :>
neuvoreligious organizations are funny how they work their
social dynamics and delineage their membership lines.

sometimes membership orgs don't like certain types of expression
or certain individuals drawing up pools of expression by members
with the intention of putting it out into the public where it might
influence sociopolitical parties, perhaps seem representational.

I've seen that with the OTO (not wanting people even to lend the
appearance that they may be representing it, due to some rampant
misunderstandings they're trying to avoid repeating).

# ...please, DO NOT tell ME to get a clue ....

not I. the only thing I could imagine doing that about I haven't
studied well enough yet to understand (history, sociopolitics).
appearances in relation to fascistic doctrines are serious enough.

Tani:
#>#> I don't particularly give a flying fuck what ANYONE believes.

Kori (just for clarity):
#># Which is why you don't seem to have grown as a person since
#># puberty.

# Wrong, [bobo]. A person who cares what others think is a FOOL,
# a PUPPET - since others do NOT pay that person's bills....

seems a somewhat simplistic argument, from where I'm standing.
sometimes the caring does seem foolish. sometimes obsessive,
sometimes it is obsequious.

# My philosophy is this - and I practice it: the smart person can
# play the fool. The strong person can play weak. And the predator
# can play prey. But NOT the other way around....

looking outside the human context, I think there are some predator-
mimics in the natural world, so the analogy only holds so far.
the point you seem to be making is a power of flexibility. some
predators do have difficulty doing more than rabidly attacking
either in defense of a perceived sleight, or on the offensive as
a kind of default attitude for purpose of drama and excitement.

# ...the person giving me so much FREE GOOD PUBLICITY on here that
# Satan Shop got TONS of DDoc orders now and will get TONS more from
# me ($$$$$$) - KNOW that I played him like a puppet because he is
# 10 kinds of STUPID? NO, I doubt he knows it even right now....

confusing. is this you explaining how I'm your dupe, or how
someone else is your patsy for some other arrangement you'd made?
would you please explain who "the person" is and who is "10 kinds
of STUPID"? thanks.

luring with disinformation, Tani gloats about hearing it echoed:
# ...That is CUNNING, [bobo]. Am I devious? Fuck yes. Sue me.

it gives the impression that you may have multi-layers of info,
some of which may be false, misleading, and deceptive, yes. that
is what I'd gone *into* many discussions with you presuming. I'm
not sure of all the details, and was recently surprised to learn
that a great deal of what you were talking about was grounded.

# ...what is the difference between a [marauding] army of genocidal
# humans offing other humans for ANY reason they choose, a pack of
# wolves cornering animals that they plan to rip to pieces brutally
# and then eat

food-prey-drive vs warfare competition-destruction.

# - and a hurricane?

the hurricane has no sensate consciousness, in Buddhist terms it
is not considered a "sentient being", whereas the wolves and the
human beings are ('feeling' beings or 'conscious' if you like).

# I see all three as forces of - WILD NATURE.

agreed. the marauding humans are giving uncontrolled vent
to their hostility, resulting in violation of other humans
(which is acknowledge as wrong by most humans).

# Neither are right or wrong, good or evil.

there you're wrong. the 'good' and 'evil' are just short-hand or
cosmic fantasies hoping to pigeon-hold morality into metaphysics.
they, like the 'right' and 'wrong', pertain to 'that which I'll
support' vs 'that which I'll oppose'. here's your breakdown:

FORMS OF SATAN -- worth opposing?
-----------------------------------------------------------
* -- hurricanes -- I won't oppose this, but I will
encourage humans to
-- curb reproductive rates to resist terraforming
-- leave forestation to keep topsoil stable
-- expect monsoons in the zones and build
so as to survive them easily
-- prepare themselves *and their wild charges*
for the storms they know to be imminent

* -- marauding/genocidal humans -- I oppose this; we
don't need or deserve human violence of any
kind against our own or other species; it is
all wrong, and what crops up lately seems to
primarily result from overt interference by
imperialist nations and the aftermath of
arrogance and resource-claiming.

* -- hunting wolves -- I support this strongly, and
want to see wolves thrive, like other large
predators who are quickly disappearing due
to human insanity and over-reproduction; I
would also be in favour of humans sacrificing
themselves *to* wolves, and having the wolves
eat human bodies as part of their diet if at
all possible and they're hunting contained.

# If the hurricane smacks ME - oh, then it's evil - LOL.

typically the 'evil' label is applied, in rational times,
where we don't think so much of the gods in charge of the
weather, to thinking beings with intentions and cruelty.

the best fictional depiction of this was Ming the Merciless.
he caused earthquakes, tidal waves, hurricanes, spontaneously,
with this futuristic technical gizmos, from space, laughing.

# Same for the genocidal humans.

this distinction may be some of the material which gets you
associated with Stalinesque apparel. I'm still not sure where
the red apparel stops and the bloodstained smiles begin.

# If the wolf bites me, same thing - I'd probably shoot it.

no doubt you're talking about being in the wilderness, alone
with some wolf wrestling to the death and you have to off it.
if not, the shot into the air would probably frighten it off.

# No difference. Good - is what is good for me. Evil is what
# is bad for me....

strictly speaking, self-interested egotism, yes....

# Heh, old Turanian saying: eat and be eaten. that's life.
# The rest is PLAY.

hurricanes don't eat. marauding humans don't eat you.
wolves don't usually hunt humans. I doubt that you'll
find many in FL where you live these days, in part
because of the misapplication of "evil" on top of them.
the wolves won't be playing with us too much longer.

# ...Come to me when I KNOW you are a person that prides
# himself on duping and conning others, and I'll con you
# blind and play really stupid and gullible :)

thanks for letting us in on how your conduct your life.

#> driving anyone from it who at least has *some* connection to
#> the topic matter is a cheap way of 'winning' debates. your
#> expression seems fairly mild on the whole. do you think that
#> the SRs should be excized from Satanism for some reason?

Tani caps on LaVey (the dead) for allegedly lying to CID about Aquino:
# I'll tell you who SHOULD be excized from ALL occultisms ...-

what kinds of occultisms are there? FROM what do you think
that LaVey should be excized, precisely? CoSatanism, surely.
generally for lying to government officials about former
government officials and their families?

blessed beast!

boboroshi at-sign satanservice.org: Satanic Outreach Director
Church of Euthanasia: http://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/
TOKUS WEBLINKS: http://dmoz.org/Bookmarks/B/boboroshi/
Ninth Scholar's Library (Satanism Archive): http://www.satanservice.org/

[SOD of the CoE]

50041205 viii om Hail Satan!

Nomen Nescio <***@dizum.com> (Tani, I think), talks with me and Tani:
# I wonder if Bobo or Cat Yronwode would be too idealistic and moral
# to admit that they are also capable of genocide?

idealistic -- practically, I wouldn't do it alone, and don't like blood
moral -- absolutely opposed to coercion, violence

# ...I bet you would say you would probably do it....

not me. I'm pacificistic, at least anti-militarist and anti-coercive.
the concept is horrible enough to witness, in countless species,
even amongst humans, that the suggestion disgusts me. even by quite
ruthless standards it is a horrible waste of genetic material.

<sounds like Tani-sock, bunches snipped>

# ...Sounds like 1984 to me....

strange manners. double-plus ungood? 'nobody really cares'?

# ...I don't think you give a shit about them or who murdered them.
# Neither do I!

fascinating admission.

# ...It's not politically corect to look at *why* the Germans did
# it, and it wasn't just Nazis or SS, it was all the Germans in on
# it. Maybe they had a reason. You probably don't *really* give
# a shit about any of it,

and let me guess, you don't either? some of us do care, yes. ;>
some of us do care if people sport fascist doctrines and symbols
in our presence. sure. those high-steppers in SCruz were something
that the CoS seems to have been concerned about very greatly. they
may even have wanted to shut down all communications about it that
are associated with the church, pro and anti (ipso facto, Tim incident).

your characterization of the CoS as fascist because of its actions
is interesting, but hardly conclusive. these kinds of groups come
down on individuals all the time for their individual interests,
primarily as they associated or might be associated with the org.

# ...people who wannabe be into chaos or anarchy might resent a person
# who is a living practicing anarchist and who is pure chaos and who
# has no morals at all? They will. They are too afraid to go
# against some kind of "morality" they set themselves up to follow.

resentment would be too good for them, too much attention. pity maybe.
maybe they're debilitated or innocent in some strange way (whacked).

# You'd kill illegals trying to enter the country....

not me. I don't go killing humans. I'm even tryin' to cut down on the
non-human beings I'm unintentionally harming. gardening is one thing,
but operating heavy machinery is a luxury I can do without often.
your ease in speaking of killing human beings is telling.

# ...you hire them to do jobs cause they're cheaper....

some friends of ours probably do. I don't recall ever doing so.

# ...held back by their own morality or dogma. ...They resent
# (fear and hate) people who are not held back by any morality
# or dogma. They might talk about wild nature, but they
# themselves are not wild nature at all, nor do they think
# or feel like wild nature. They hate and fear anyone who
# really does.

I'm the primary advocate of wild nature by phrase here,
so you're talking to me, responding to Tani with Tani-sock.

Satan can be very dangerous, so fear is sometimes warranted.
that said, what passes for irresponsibility and wanton
violence on the part of humans is a behaviour which I would
like to strongly oppose, as I've consistently chosen from
when it was my decision to make to date. if that's wild nature,
that's all well and good. let's see it for what it is, NOT
demonize it, NOT glorify it, and talk about minimizing the
casualties, ok?

people without inner guidance, without bearings, who are
full of rage, uncontrolled vitriol, unleashing it in acts of
mayhem, destruction, genocide, deserve to get the help they
deserve, perhaps under observation, if they seem to be some
kind of danger to others. my main concern as regards their
own safety would be that, like all of us, we get the kind
of deaths we desire and deserve. speaking of that (you're
trying again to catch me on your radar, socky-Tani:)

# Also, people who belong to the Church of Euthanazia,

that's
Church of Euthanasia
Snailmail: C.O.E., Box 261, Somerville, MA 02143
Remember: SODOMY prevents ABORTIONS!
Emergency Contraception:18005849911

# an organization blatantly against humans,

against the continued reproductive rates of humans. some
of our members are anti-human, but the church as a whole,
a concept you, Tani, seem to have difficulty conceiving,
limits its overt support to non-coercive methods, and yet
is tolerant of certain forms of expression within its
forums that extend beyond these advocations (to violence).

# bitching about a million dead humans seems strange to me.

strange that you make the comment at all, until your above
admissions about what you care about and about your lack
of morals, etc. that said, some of my closest kindred have
said such things in their despair over the trends.

# They should see Hitler and Stalin and Pol Pot and Mao
# as the good guys for wiping out a bunch of humans.

some of the extremists do, but most understand that the
warfare engaged by human beings kills many more nonhumans
and ruins far more of the ecosystem in which they are fought
(Momma Terra, you know, the biosphere, that great God that
the Being communicated with Revv Chrissy about in vision)
than chosen solutions without violence. we're better off
starting from the top down and affording rights than just
throwing the lid off and applauding the truly horrific.

# Columbus should be one of their saints.

noncoercive choice is always our aim, Tani-sock, as a
church. conformity with society less important where it
pertains to *GOOD DEATHS*. for this reason a well-timed
suicide is far better than a single attempted coersion.
as I recall revealing information about how horrible
Christopher Columbus was included in CoE documents.

saints I've heard of so far include:
* Saint Kevorkian
* Saints of Heaven's Gate
* Margaret Sanger

my suggestion:
* Saint Francis of Assisi

# > Come to me with a hint of any agenda - and I'll smell it and
# > say nothing to hint I smell it - and I might play along. Usually that
# > person doesn't even know he has an agenda. Come to me when I KNOW you are a
# > person that prides himself on duping and conning others, and I'll con you
# > blind and play really stupid and gullible :)
#
# They really don't like to think on that too much. It makes them
# feel weak and small and powerless.

is this an example of your attempt to dupe and con others? if so,
should we consider this evidence that you know we're coming to
you with an agenda, one that we might not even know about?
it might excuse all manner of horrid behaviour on your part,
at least in your mind. then you might also say that you were
spoofed too in order to escape being held accountable for
your expressionss.

# ...you from way back when you didn't have a problem "seeing
# drones" where there only may have been drones. You called
# them drones too.

Tani-drones? Scratch and Lupo used to call them your Flying
Monkeys, I think. I made reference to it recently in conv
with you elsewhere in another thread. I found the use of the
term amusing considering the history behind it in alt.satanism.

are you now reduced to speaking about me in front of me, Tani?
the sock-game is pretty lame, if so. maybe the once-drones have
deserted you and now you've spritzed up your act with puppets?

blessed beast!

boboroshi at-sign satanservice.org: Satanic Outreach Director
Church of Euthanasia: http://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/
TOKUS WEBLINKS: http://dmoz.org/Bookmarks/B/boboroshi/
Ninth Scholar's Library (Satanism Archive): http://www.satanservice.org/

[SOD of the CoE]

sri catyananda:
#> Nomen, you make a god sock for Tani. I like your writing style here
#> better than when you do the BIG CAPITALIST LETTERS thing, HA! It's a
#> bit more intellectual.

"Tani Jantsang" <***@SPAMpost.com>:
# I went and read his post - ONLY because I see YOU have posted to it. You
# see, I read what he had to say after I read THIS and am now responding to
# YOU, to Cat....

# I DO realize that this person knows me from another org
# unrelated to satanism or politics - or I think he does unless he faked it (I
# doubt it). I can tell from something in there that relates to that other
# org. And he has me pegged about 90% right on some of that. I'd have to
# read it again. I wouldn't have read it, except that I read THIS post.
# Yours. You see, Nomen Nescio nicks have 90% of the time FLAMED me - and
# done other bad shit that spilled to OFFLINE.

why do you suppose that is, Tani? why is this person trying to impersonate
*you* posting from an anonymous remailer? some known adversary of yours?
who spells things similarly, and has similar interests? or is it all an
act and they've studied your personal ticks and habits? maybe they're
trying to confuse people and spread disinformation? who might it be?

and it spilled *offline*, too? sorry to hear that. this a consistent
problem you've been facing? if so, have you spoken with legal counsel?
do you think it has to do with your being a Satanist, or an SR?
could it be connected with MIM or with some other outfit?

courage, blessed beast!

boboroshi at-sign satanservice.org: Satanic Outreach Director
Church of Euthanasia: http://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/
TOKUS WEBLINKS: http://dmoz.org/Bookmarks/B/boboroshi/
Ninth Scholar's Library (Satanism Archive): http://www.satanservice.org/

[Tani Jantsang]

Post by SOD of the CoE
#> Nomen, you make a god sock for Tani. I like your writing style here
#> better than when you do the BIG CAPITALIST LETTERS thing, HA! It's a
#> bit more intellectual.
# I went and read his post - ONLY because I see YOU have posted to it.
You
# see, I read what he had to say after I read THIS and am now responding to
# YOU, to Cat....
# I DO realize that this person knows me from another org
# unrelated to satanism or politics - or I think he does unless he faked it (I
# doubt it). I can tell from something in there that relates to that other
# org. And he has me pegged about 90% right on some of that. I'd have to
# read it again. I wouldn't have read it, except that I read THIS post.
# Yours. You see, Nomen Nescio nicks have 90% of the time FLAMED me - and
# done other bad shit that spilled to OFFLINE.
why do you suppose that is, Tani? why is this person trying to impersonate
*you* posting from an anonymous remailer?

I didn't see it as impersonating me, but then I didn't read it carefully,
either.

some known adversary of yours?

Post by SOD of the CoE
who spells things similarly, and has similar interests? or is it all an
act and they've studied your personal ticks and habits? maybe they're
trying to confuse people and spread disinformation? who might it be?

I sent an email to the eod org and asked WHO was posting here. No answer
yet. It's either one of them, has to be - or it's one of the same people
fucking with me on here PRETENDING to be "nice." I've seen that shit
before. Plenty of times. From what I read - and I did read it, it was not
DISinformation at all. 90% of what it "guessed" about me was pretty on
target.

Post by SOD of the CoE
and it spilled *offline*, too? sorry to hear that. this a consistent
problem you've been facing? if so, have you spoken with legal counsel?

Yes, most say ignore it. Criminal attorney said shoot them if they come
near me - cops also said it. Internet is a problem because it's interstate.

Post by SOD of the CoE
do you think it has to do with your being a Satanist, or an SR?
could it be connected with MIM or with some other outfit?

I have no idea. I do know where it came from because it was openly posted
on here . Filan, online bully for the COS and spokesperson, posted a list
of my neighbors with clear language of incitement. I'm anti COS - or at
least they THINK I am. They DO act like a cult - a cult of fanatics with
LaVey as their Fuehrer. I know what Gilmore wrote in personal emails to
heh - people that ended up leaving his group and coming with us. I know
what he told me on the phone before he knew I was going to expose and trash
them.

Post by SOD of the CoE
courage, blessed beast!

I don't live in fear. But it is NO joke - if any of these bozos ever came
near me, I'd immediately regard it as a threat to my life and - KILL them.
No joke. The cop said to make a post (back then) to this Jordon person
(Harry Lime) stating that if he came here to visit me as he kept saying he
would - about 100 times he said it, that I would shoot him dead.

Mim tried hard to make trouble for me because I would NOT go along with
them. so what, I got paid to type for them - they are 100 times worse than
Jehova's Witnesses and I did tell them that. I also typed for the JWs -
and they never ONCE preached to me about joining their religion. I know
exactly what Maoists would DO if they had real power. As tiny and pathetic
as these pasty faced white wimps in MIM are, they sure did try to make
trouble.

The way of YIN. Keep accusing ME of being an FBI agent or a narc for the
FBI and I'll OBLIGE them by - sending all their shit to the FBI and all
emails to them to stop libeling me with a cc to the FBI. I did do that.
That is the way of YIN. But at the start of it? They had an ad that Bren
saw - "TYPIST NEEDED." Viola - B told me, I contacted them, we agreed on a
price - 9 bucks a page. End of story. Or it SHOULD have been. I'm not
going to repeat this.

Post by SOD of the CoE
boboroshi at-sign satanservice.org: Satanic Outreach Director
Church of Euthanasia: http://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/
TOKUS WEBLINKS: http://dmoz.org/Bookmarks/B/boboroshi/
Ninth Scholar's Library (Satanism Archive): http://www.satanservice.org/

[SOD of the CoE]

50041207 viii om Hail Satan!

bobo praises Tani for her overt non-sock expressions in comparison to anons:
#> weaklings.
#> Tani's at least got one head in the air (uncovered by socks).

"Tani Jantsang" <***@SPAMpost.com>:
# Once more - I do not have socks ....

if true, then someone is attempting to give the impression that you do,
and has similar enough characteristic expression that they're doing a
pretty good job of appearing to be like you, supportive of you. weird.

# ...if you follow the mess of flames that Harry and his drone squad ....

nope, no really interested, until it intersects real Satanism.

# They have cyber staked ME - them and their anon socks.

I don't regard usenet troll-harrying as stalking. those who
claim it is are, in my opinion, drama monarchs (queen/king).

# After Harry made a kind of rape threat post about his dick, balls and cum
# and my face, and made other such veiled threats to me, I showed the police
# here and a criminal lawyer. The police said to shoot him if he comes near
# me. The criminal lawyer said the same thing, said that most people from the
# state he's in are loonies from fringe groups, and said that I should ignore
# him entirely....

# No, it was no joke.

sounds like very good advice.

#> not much, apparently, or at least not much about history
#> and politics, which she seems keen in proposing from
#> certain valences.

in case there is any unclarity here, I'm referring to the
apparent "JOKE", your Stalin/Lysenko apparel you're parading.
it is damned peculiar given the history you have in 'outing'
fascist and anti-fascist literature/activities in the CoS.

#> I'm not much better,

in case there is any unclarity here, I'm referring to the
fact that I am pretty ignorant where history and politics
become the focus. I supplement with referrals to people
who seem to know something, and try to focus, topically,
on the stipulated interest of the forum to which I'm posting.

#> but ally with love rather than with callow cynicism.

in case there is any unclarity here, I'm referring to the
issue of 'whether it is valuable/moral to kill 1 billion
humans and oneself without harming any other species'.

such a fantasy conception is comparable to the 'what if'
scenarios used against pacifists to give the impression
of cowardice and lack of extremity. since it will never
come to pass, it has little value to me, but the issue
of coersion is a real one we can contemplate concretely.

# I do not see you allying with love "go kill yourself
# and don't breed."

that's the negative aspect of it, Tani. the positive is:

FUCK OFF AND DIE BY CHOICE!!

or FOAD BC!
if you like.

# That is thanatos.

good thanatos. :> euthanasia. good death to sperm and
eggs, good death to human adults. excellent morals,
responsible and even utilitarian! Satanic!

# Of course I don't believe much about history or politics.
# It's utter bullshit.

then why do you care about Tim's antics and censure in the CoS?

#># or hawks on the internet, whether she's actually "Turanian,"
#>
#> seems so.
#
# Of course, he does not regard that as a racist statement.
# Fine. Racism is OK.

subtle semantics sometimes make it more palatable. the term
'racialism' is sometimes used to effectively justify this,
reserving 'racism' for discriminating bigotry.

preferences for genetic make-up in one's breeding and one's
social interactions is something we may each select if we
like. I like and support that freedom of choice, and do not
personally restrict myself to those limitations (choosing,
responsibly, not to breed, and, to enjoy the variety of
genetics around me, noting preferrable breeds -- I've got
a selection for dogs already, not enough data on humans).

#># or whether she was ever a member of the CoS.
#>
#> entitled before they stripped it away....
#
# I had the title, but never used it.

I've heard that part before. 'never' is an extreme assertion
given the following exception.

# But then I DID use it when I trashed the holy hell out of
# the pro fascists in the COS, I used it to help Tim get his
# anti fascist essay, and I used it to expose the shit that
# was going on. Then I printed out all of it, mailed it ALL
# to Barton to make sure she'd see it (she's anti computer
# and not online, apparently). What do you think she'd do
# when I did something that "bad" to her and her org? ...The
# leaders in the brigade against Tim's anti fascist article
# - and me - happened to be the Davis couple and the Gidney
# couple. Davis is now dead. Gidney is in jail. I gave
# you the urls.

so the timing on the withdrawal of the titles (for the 3 of
you?) was after you sent all that material to MTR Barton.
thanks.

blessed beast!

boboroshi at-sign satanservice.org: Satanic Outreach Director
Church of Euthanasia: http://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/
TOKUS WEBLINKS: http://dmoz.org/Bookmarks/B/boboroshi/
Ninth Scholar's Library (Satanism Archive): http://www.satanservice.org/

[Tani Jantsang]

Post by SOD of the CoE
50041207 viii om Hail Satan!
#> weaklings.
#> Tani's at least got one head in the air (uncovered by socks).

I do not post anon. Period. I have no need to. I can say FUCK BUSH on
here and have no fear that the Big Cops are gonna do something to me, or
cancel my account.

You make a quick jump to assume I or anyone I knew posted anon. Turns out
that my co-org member in the eod did NOT make that post! WHO IS IT that
takes special care to notice typos? HA HA. That's who posted it. Had to
be.

Post by SOD of the CoE
# Once more - I do not have socks ....
if true, then someone is attempting to give the impression that you do,
and has similar enough characteristic expression that they're doing a
pretty good job of appearing to be like you, supportive of you. weird.

Not weird at all. PAR for the course on here. See above sentence.

Post by SOD of the CoE
# ...if you follow the mess of flames that Harry and his drone squad ....
nope, no really interested, until it intersects real Satanism.
# They have cyber staked ME - them and their anon socks.
I don't regard usenet troll-harrying as stalking.

When it spills to offline real life - IT IS. And it HAS done that.

those who

Post by SOD of the CoE
claim it is are, in my opinion, drama monarchs (queen/king).
# After Harry made a kind of rape threat post about his dick, balls and cum
# and my face, and made other such veiled threats to me, I showed the police
# here and a criminal lawyer. The police said to shoot him if he comes near
# me. The criminal lawyer said the same thing, said that most people from the
# state he's in are loonies from fringe groups, and said that I should ignore
# him entirely....
# No, it was no joke.

No, it was not a joke. According to the ADL head in Miami, "shut up oven
stuffer" is a death threat. When they say that, it has clout. No use
arguing. COS did a purge of their nazis not long after that shit hit the
fan OFFLINE. Coincidence? Uh, Maybe.

Post by SOD of the CoE
sounds like very good advice.
#> not much, apparently, or at least not much about history
#> and politics, which she seems keen in proposing from
#> certain valences.
in case there is any unclarity here, I'm referring to the
apparent "JOKE", your Stalin/Lysenko apparel you're parading.
it is damned peculiar given the history you have in 'outing'
fascist and anti-fascist literature/activities in the CoS.

I do not make the big mistake of assuming that J. Arch Getty is pro stalin
because he wrote things with open archives at hand that contradict a LOT of
the propaganda on both sides. Only a moron would think that - and I have no
use for such "thinkers." I have exposed things about TD Lysenko and the
NKVD - proving that things said about him were false. Phil has written a
very Getty like article on Stalin AND Yezhov - it's not pro. anyone that
thinks this is more than just what it is, is a moron with paranoia issues.
I could care less about it. Subject closed.

Post by SOD of the CoE
#> I'm not much better,
in case there is any unclarity here, I'm referring to the
fact that I am pretty ignorant where history and politics
become the focus. I supplement with referrals to people
who seem to know something, and try to focus, topically,
on the stipulated interest of the forum to which I'm posting.
#> but ally with love rather than with callow cynicism.
in case there is any unclarity here, I'm referring to the
issue of 'whether it is valuable/moral to kill 1 billion
humans and oneself without harming any other species'.

It is not moral at all It might be valuable. It is genocide. Period.

Post by SOD of the CoE
such a fantasy conception is comparable to the 'what if'
scenarios used against pacifists to give the impression
of cowardice and lack of extremity. since it will never
come to pass, it has little value to me, but the issue
of coersion is a real one we can contemplate concretely.
# I do not see you allying with love "go kill yourself
# and don't breed."
FUCK OFF AND DIE BY CHOICE!!
or FOAD BC!
if you like.
# That is thanatos.
good thanatos. :> euthanasia. good death to sperm and
eggs, good death to human adults. excellent morals,
responsible and even utilitarian! Satanic!
# Of course I don't believe much about history or politics.
# It's utter bullshit.
then why do you care about Tim's antics and censure in the CoS?

Because for one, I got PAID to help find out stuff about them, - 2. and then
members of the cos were asking me to help them agaist the fascist faction
that bullies them. 3. Also, I liked the idea of the whole bunch of essays.

Post by SOD of the CoE
#># or hawks on the internet, whether she's actually "Turanian,"
#>
#> seems so.
#
# Of course, he does not regard that as a racist statement.
# Fine. Racism is OK.
subtle semantics sometimes make it more palatable. the term
'racialism' is sometimes used to effectively justify this,
reserving 'racism' for discriminating bigotry.
preferences for genetic make-up in one's breeding and one's
social interactions is something we may each select if we
like. I like and support that freedom of choice, and do not
personally restrict myself to those limitations (choosing,
responsibly, not to breed, and, to enjoy the variety of
genetics around me, noting preferrable breeds -- I've got
a selection for dogs already, not enough data on humans).
#># or whether she was ever a member of the CoS.
#>
#> entitled before they stripped it away....
#
# I had the title, but never used it.
I've heard that part before. 'never' is an extreme assertion
given the following exception.
# But then I DID use it when I trashed the holy hell out of
# the pro fascists in the COS, I used it to help Tim get his
# anti fascist essay, and I used it to expose the shit that
# was going on. Then I printed out all of it, mailed it ALL
# to Barton to make sure she'd see it (she's anti computer
# and not online, apparently). What do you think she'd do
# when I did something that "bad" to her and her org? ...The
# leaders in the brigade against Tim's anti fascist article
# - and me - happened to be the Davis couple and the Gidney
# couple. Davis is now dead. Gidney is in jail. I gave
# you the urls.
so the timing on the withdrawal of the titles (for the 3 of
you?) was after you sent all that material to MTR Barton.
thanks.

No, Tim succumbed and is still in the COS as far as I know. What 3 of us?
Who? Vad wrote her a scathing letter and was expelled - but Vad WAS a
member. I was not a member of the COS, Tyagi. Honoray title is just that -
honorary outside their org. Gidney was not expelled until AFTER he got
caught doing naughty. I made what I said clear YOU managed to muddle it
up.

Post by SOD of the CoE
blessed beast!
boboroshi at-sign satanservice.org: Satanic Outreach Director
Church of Euthanasia: http://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/
TOKUS WEBLINKS: http://dmoz.org/Bookmarks/B/boboroshi/
Ninth Scholar's Library (Satanism Archive): http://www.satanservice.org/

[SOD of the CoE]

50041207 viii om Hail Satan!

regarding appearances and realities and history in Sat-Tanism.

bobo:
#>#> not much, apparently, or at least not much about history
#>#> and politics, which she seems keen in proposing from
#>#> certain valences.

bobo elaborates:
#> in case there is any unclarity here, I'm referring to the
#> apparent "JOKE", your Stalin/Lysenko apparel you're parading.
#> it is damned peculiar given the history you have in 'outing'
#> fascist and anti-fascist literature/activities in the CoS.

"Tani Jantsang" <***@SPAMpost.com>:
# I do not make the big mistake of assuming that J. Arch Getty
# is pro stalin because he wrote things with open archives at
# hand that contradict a LOT of the propaganda on both sides....

very good thinking. did JAGetty ever post with the pseudonym of
"NKVD" or "NaKiVeD" or "People's Commisar"? did said individual
ever post gushing praise of TDLysenko from WWII? can you fathom
why someone who is doing this, especially with a family history
of association with or membership in said organization,
might be perceived as neo-Stalinesque?

# ...I have exposed things about TD Lysenko and the NKVD -
# proving that things said about him were false....

wonderful. did you do this for any particular reason? do you
believe that some of the negative things said about him are
also TRUE?

# Phil has written a very Getty like article on Stalin AND
# Yezhov - it's not pro. anyone that thinks this is more
# than just what it is, is a moron with paranoia issues.

well, I wasn't going to mention him, but since you're comparing
him and your activities, did he ever go online or publish in
writing things under pseudonyms with "questionable" valences,
such as 'NKVD' or 'NaKiVeD' or "People's Commisar"? I guess not,
since you say that he "is not online" in a sense of presence.

bobo allies with his preference:
#>#> but ally with love rather than with callow cynicism.

elaborating:
#> in case there is any unclarity here, I'm referring to the
#> issue of 'whether it is valuable/moral to kill 1 billion
#> humans and oneself without harming any other species'.

# It is not moral at all It might be valuable. It is genocide.
# Period.

depends on how it is done. the way I understood sri catyananda's
agreement to it, it wouldn't constitute genocide at all (because
she isn't going to be selecting strictly from a specific group,
like the Jews or the Kalmyks or whoever, but prefers to conceive
of it as more or less randomly or focussing more on overpopulated
regions first and thinning the herds). corrections welcomed.

# ...I got PAID to help find out stuff about them,

by whom?

# - 2. and then members of the cos were asking me to help them
# [against] the fascist faction that bullies them.

admirable assistance on your part.

# 3. Also, I liked the idea of the whole bunch of essays.

you display it well on your Satanic Reds website, thanks.

#># But then I DID use it when I trashed the holy hell out of
#># the pro fascists in the COS, I used it to help Tim get his
#># anti fascist essay, and I used it to expose the shit that
#># was going on. Then I printed out all of it, mailed it ALL
#># to Barton to make sure she'd see it (she's anti computer
#># and not online, apparently). What do you think she'd do
#># when I did something that "bad" to her and her org? ...The
#># leaders in the brigade against Tim's anti fascist article
#># - and me - happened to be the Davis couple and the Gidney
#># couple. Davis is now dead. Gidney is in jail. I gave
#># you the urls.
#>
#> so the timing on the withdrawal of the titles (for the 3 of
#> you?) was after you sent all that material to MTR Barton.
#> thanks.
#
# No, Tim succumbed and is still in the COS as far as I know.
# What 3 of us?

the 3 who were given the honourary titles in the CoS, of course:
you, Phil Marsh, and Hr. Vad (for your work on the DDocs; plus
a Grotto (Prometheus, now defunct?)).

# Who? Vad wrote her a scathing letter and was expelled -
# but Vad WAS a member.

removing the title. was Phil Marsh's title also removed?
I got the bit about memberships, thanks for the clarification.

blessed beast!

boboroshi at-sign satanservice.org: Satanic Outreach Director
Church of Euthanasia: http://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/
TOKUS WEBLINKS: http://dmoz.org/Bookmarks/B/boboroshi/
Ninth Scholar's Library (Satanism Archive): http://www.satanservice.org/

[Tani Jantsang]

Post by SOD of the CoE
50041207 viii om Hail Satan!
regarding appearances and realities and history in Sat-Tanism.
#>#> not much, apparently, or at least not much about history
#>#> and politics, which she seems keen in proposing from
#>#> certain valences.
#> in case there is any unclarity here, I'm referring to the
#> apparent "JOKE", your Stalin/Lysenko apparel you're parading.
#> it is damned peculiar given the history you have in 'outing'
#> fascist and anti-fascist literature/activities in the CoS.
# I do not make the big mistake of assuming that J. Arch Getty
# is pro stalin because he wrote things with open archives at
# hand that contradict a LOT of the propaganda on both sides....
very good thinking. did JAGetty ever post with the pseudonym of
"NKVD" or "NaKiVeD"

nakived is naki ved and reversed devi kan. The meaning is none of anyone's
business. You paranoid, or something? That's not a pseudonym. That's my
EMAIL.

Post by SOD of the CoE
or "People's Commisar"?

Everyone in SR is a People's Commissar. What the hell is wrong with that?

did said individual

Post by SOD of the CoE
ever post gushing praise of TDLysenko from WWII?

What you see as praise, I view as objective archival information. IT IS
objective - and what I said in there is true.

can you fathom

Post by SOD of the CoE
why someone who is doing this, especially with a family history
of association with or membership in said organization,
might be perceived as neo-Stalinesque?

I can see that someone like you might see it that way because you ARE seeing
it that way. I don't care. Ask me my political views that do NOT change -
I'll refer you to the 10 statements of SR. I also have some anti commies in
my family, Tyagi - that is why I know for a fact that the Soviets who were
convinced that "wrecking" was going on were right. Every Islamic relation
has parents that BRAG about how they wrecked shit there. And they obviously
got away with it! I have both in my family, Tyagi. I already said I think
Stalin was the right guy for the job over there back then. But not for the
USA and not for any industrialized techno country. So? I have no problem
with my stance on that. You apparently DO! LMAO. And yeah, LMAO.

Post by SOD of the CoE
# ...I have exposed things about TD Lysenko and the NKVD -
# proving that things said about him were false....
wonderful. did you do this for any particular reason? do you
believe that some of the negative things said about him are
also TRUE?

Nope, they are factually UNTRUE and can be proven to be untrue. Tyagi, he
wasn't even a communist party member. He was a botanist. A reason? Do I
have to have a reason to do anything like that? Phil is writing an essay as
long as a book - still ongoing - with the botanical stuff in it about TDL -
exposing the falsehoods with REAL references to his OWN WRITINGS (which all
the others never put in there) and with real facts from modern botany.

Post by SOD of the CoE
# Phil has written a very Getty like article on Stalin AND
# Yezhov - it's not pro. anyone that thinks this is more
# than just what it is, is a moron with paranoia issues.
well, I wasn't going to mention him, but since you're comparing
him and your activities, did he ever go online or publish in
writing things under pseudonyms with "questionable" valences,
such as 'NKVD' or 'NaKiVeD' or "People's Commisar"? I guess not,
since you say that he "is not online" in a sense of presence.

See above.

Post by SOD of the CoE
#>#> but ally with love rather than with callow cynicism.
#> in case there is any unclarity here, I'm referring to the
#> issue of 'whether it is valuable/moral to kill 1 billion
#> humans and oneself without harming any other species'.
# It is not moral at all It might be valuable. It is genocide.
# Period.
depends on how it is done. the way I understood sri catyananda's
agreement to it, it wouldn't constitute genocide at all (because
she isn't going to be selecting strictly from a specific group,
like the Jews or the Kalmyks or whoever, but prefers to conceive
of it as more or less randomly or focussing more on overpopulated
regions first and thinning the herds). corrections welcomed.

She didn't say that. So then, Africa would go, India would go, China would
go. They are highly overpopulated areas. China is taking action about its
population. Eugenics.

Post by SOD of the CoE
# ...I got PAID to help find out stuff about them,
by whom?

Jeff - Jewish, NOT a Satanist. I don't know WHY he wanted to do this, I
can theorize - but it's just a theory.

Post by SOD of the CoE
# - 2. and then members of the cos were asking me to help them
# [against] the fascist faction that bullies them.
admirable assistance on your part.

Yes, maybe, but I'd not have done it or paid any attention to it if not for
the insistance of Jeff - and then the offered help of some COS members
themselves AND others that were harassed and bullied and yes - THREATENED
(with death!).

Post by SOD of the CoE
# 3. Also, I liked the idea of the whole bunch of essays.
you display it well on your Satanic Reds website, thanks.
#># But then I DID use it when I trashed the holy hell out of
#># the pro fascists in the COS, I used it to help Tim get his
#># anti fascist essay, and I used it to expose the shit that
#># was going on. Then I printed out all of it, mailed it ALL
#># to Barton to make sure she'd see it (she's anti computer
#># and not online, apparently). What do you think she'd do
#># when I did something that "bad" to her and her org? ...The
#># leaders in the brigade against Tim's anti fascist article
#># - and me - happened to be the Davis couple and the Gidney
#># couple. Davis is now dead. Gidney is in jail. I gave
#># you the urls.
#>
#> so the timing on the withdrawal of the titles (for the 3 of
#> you?) was after you sent all that material to MTR Barton.
#> thanks.
#
# No, Tim succumbed and is still in the COS as far as I know.
# What 3 of us?
you, Phil Marsh, and Hr. Vad (for your work on the DDocs; plus
a Grotto (Prometheus, now defunct?)).

OH, Vad and me yes. Ole Wolf too, he was kicked out. Both Ole and Vad were
MEMBERS of the COS. Phil and I are NOT members. Ole put up the COS FILES
and that was the entire package I mailed to Barton. It was brutal. He
didn't write the files. The COS fascist faction themselves wrote them!
Gilmore's "be our waffen SS" super private email to "select members" was
exposed. He's telling his members, certain ones in the "in-clique" to be
his EINSATZGRUPPEN. What the hell do you think that means? "Go flame our
enemies?" HA! NO. You never saw this? I'll put it below. Phil had
nothing to do with any of this - he's not online. Tyagi, he doesn't even
know how to use a puter and doesn't care about puters or internet. All of
the information he ever got from the internet via me doing a search was
shabby in the extreme, misstated science even, one side only showig up. He
goes to JOURNALS, hard copy and first hand sources if he can. LIBRARY.
Getting ours hands on everything TDLysenko ever wrote was NOT EASY, Tyagi.
Finding out which parts he actually wrote, which parts he did NOT write was
exposed by Rosianov who GOT the actual hand-written original document! NOT
EASY. How he did that, he could have been jailed for it in the USSR. For
instance, it is asserted 99% in any search that there is NO WAY to tell what
"race" a human being is via genetics. Meanwhile there is a lab you can GO TO
where they can tell you if you are 12% Native American, 14% Semitic, 2%
African and so forth. And they do that all the time to IDENTIFY population
migrations. So what's online is SHIT. I finally GOT the information - and
it was like pulling fucking teeth to get it - and made an article "Is there
such a thing as race?" and put it up with the FIRST HAND charts from the
genetic experts. WHY is this so hard to get? WHO wants to deny the reality
of it and keep it secret? Free speech my ass, LOL.
http://www.geocities.com/satanicreds/variation.html

And some of the links that used to work on there, were oddly REMOVED!!!
WHY?

Post by SOD of the CoE
# Who? Vad wrote her a scathing letter and was expelled -
# but Vad WAS a member.
removing the title. was Phil Marsh's title also removed?
I got the bit about memberships, thanks for the clarification.

Phil Marsh was not involved. As far as I know, he still has the title - but
what does that mean? I asked him if he still has it. He doesn't know.
Obviously, he doesn't care, either.

Hey, give me a title in your org, if you have an org. Priestess Tani. Go
ahead. Do you think I'll USE IT? I still have a title in Embasat, LOL.
Priestess. So what?

Oh, btw, Jerome never said he was black or anything OTHER than what he is.
Yeah, he's hung like a bull. Yeah, he likes oral. Yeah, he's gay. I
noticed the reams of DISinformation jumped on by the gang of drones that you
oddly don't seem to notice on here. Heh.

OH, and btw - who is it that focuses on typos people make? The gang of
drones do. I emailed into the eod group and asked WHO posted recently and
signed it 23rd. I got an email back from the guy who legit posted using a
remailer as Nomen Nescio - he did NOT post this one this time. So now I
know that the very people that picked up on typos I tend to make, must have
been the ones that posted it! Viola.

I should think that reasonable sane people would think about how LONG they
have obsessed on me, jumping into threads I happen to be on and throwing
stones at me on those threads - way off topic. But then, I think these
people are not reasonable or sane. One day after 9/11, this newsgroup was
filled with bitching at Tani. That is something really LAUGH at.

Post by SOD of the CoE
blessed beast!
boboroshi at-sign satanservice.org: Satanic Outreach Director
Church of Euthanasia: http://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/
TOKUS WEBLINKS: http://dmoz.org/Bookmarks/B/boboroshi/
Ninth Scholar's Library (Satanism Archive): http://www.satanservice.org/

[Tani Jantsang]

I forgot to post this. This was emailed long before I was online - and it
got outed obviously by one of the people who received it.

From: "hpoelzig" <***@ix.netcom.com>

To: <***@ix.netcom.com>

Subject: Attack/Counter-Attack?

Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 16:51:52 +0200

Message-ID: <***@dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com>

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To our gang of regular alt.satanism posters:



I've noted a disappointing trend of late, and was curious as to why it

has arisen. Aside from the usual attacks on our organization/philosophy,

our detractors seem to delight in ad hominem attacks on the acknowledged

leaders of the Church of Satan.



This is nothing new, but they have been increasing in frequency. Anton

LaVey naturally gets the bulk of them (as founder and long-term leader),

but we have seen a spate of attacks on our High Priestess Blanche Barton,

Online Representative (and frequent defender of our supportive members

when they are attacked) Magistra Peggy Nadramia, Magister Boyd Rice, and

also myself.



Since neither Peggy nor I assiduously keep up with this forum for

spewage, we don't follow these snipes directly, but many of you do

forward them to us. What we don't then see are forwards of your responses

to these shabby posts. When we go to look, we often don't see many

responses, if any, while the peanut gallery chimes in with a litany of

abuse that largely goes unanswered.



If the forwards are meant for us to compile a list of creeps who, if

members, will be eventually terminated--we understand. But it appears to

me that, when these comments go without response, it looks like there is

some kind of tacit approval by all of you, who are clearly seen as voices

and thus representatives of the Church of Satan (and several on the list

of folk getting this are in the Priesthood, and a number of others may

yet achieve official public spokesperson status).



To be specific: Recently we have seen "Raw Scent" (aka Audey Morgan,

"Cameobuyer," "Belphagor," etc.--overweight homosexual and eBay

shill-bidder), YRabishu (no info), and David Cromwell (a wannabee writer

who sent a crappy article to TBF and when we didn't respond soon enough

sent a snotty email claiming we were stealing his material. I responded

that he's on my shit list for this behavior [and his writing really does,

by objective criteria for such things, suck]. He has since crawled back

with an apology and has not been favored with any response.). There are

others (the variably present Paul Valentine comes to mind). If you

haven't found enough info on these creeps to do a fair-play turnabout,

I'm certain that you have enough information on the individuals being

attacked to simply point out their many achievements as a counter. Also,

the very nature of these attacks are clear signs to anyone with even a

modicum of cold-reading ability to provide ammunition for a

surgical-strike response post.



We constantly see both Blanche and Peggy being accused of being fat when

in actuality neither of these ladies is obese, simply full-figured, which

is only a crime to those who follow herd values (and something of which

homosexuals are often jealous). Any who know these ladies personally can

vouch for their command-to-look powers. They also try to couple "lazy"

with this. Gee, our High Priestess is now a widow who is also raising a

child and running an international organization (and just recently

released a bang-up issue of "The Cloven Hoof") Peggy is accused of

holding back TBF (which is really my fault as I've spent too much time on

the official website--basically a single-handed creation), when she just

released another issue of her World fantasy Award-winning magazine,

"Grue." That these people are sitting at their keyboards, contributing

nothing but vitriol and waiting like the sucking black holes they are for

our products to fill their empty lives--products which they clearly can't

live without, should be obvious and easy to point out.



So, I know that all of you lead productive and very busy lives, and that

you all know what a cistern usenet is, but since you have made a presence

there (of your own free wills you have put on the hip-waders and gas

masks) and are looked to by those who merely lurk, it would certainly

help to preserve the image of the Church of Satan as one of a den of

rattlesnakes, extremely dangerous and loyal to the death in defense of

each other (an image Dr. LaVey wanted projected) if you pointed out the

nature of these blatherings and what it demonstrates about those who post

them.



Peggy particularly has worked to promote projects by many of you--both

online and in print, and HP Barton does the same in "TCH." Anton LaVey's

laurels are there for all to see. Boyd Rice also has quite a public body

of exemplary material, and you all know something about myself, I trust.



I haven't addressed this to any individuals specifically, and many of you

haven't ignored these attacks, and responded properly. And we note these

responses and they do mean something. But lately the guard has been let

down, and the image that comes to my mind by the resounding silence is

that of those faithful awaiting the arousal of the distant Gods to strike

the utterers of blasphemy.



We aren't theists, waiting for someone else to "Make it so." As

Satanists, we must take the bull by the balls and shatter all who oppose

us. That is, if you really do respect those who are being attacked.



You are all our shock troops, our special forces, our Waffen SS, and we'd

like to see you perhaps interact with one another and coordinate your

attacks on those who dare to try to besmirch our organization, and those

of us who I think have earned your respect as your leaders.



There are some out there, like Paul Valentine, who desperately seek

attention, particularly from those whom he attacks. But you can turn his

eustress to distress when armed with the proper ammo. Come to us for the

information if you need it, but I know that you all have enough savvy and

skill to work amongst yourselves to come up with tactical responses that

would make us proud.



So, here's to swatting the flies (it may not take that much effort) so

that we can continue with all of the real business of moving the world in

our chosen directions.



Hail Satan!



Peter H. Gilmore



THIS EMAIL WAS MAILED AS BCC TO GILMORE'S LOYAL STORM TROOPERS. IT IS NOT
ASKING PEOPLE TO TEASE ANYONE ONLINE. IT IS ASKING THEM TO BE LIKE THE
WAFFEN SS, AND THE EINSATZGRUPPEN - IN OTHER WORDS, AN EXTERMINATION SQUAD.
Come to him for the information!

[Harry Lime]

Ha! Long before you were online and *while* you were a Magistra in good
standing, in other words. Didn't make much of a fuss then, did you Tani?
The CoS took your title *away* you didn't leave voluntarily. LOL.

Regards,

Harry Lime
www.harrylimetv.com/

Post by Tani Jantsang
I forgot to post this. This was emailed long before I was online - and it
got outed obviously by one of the people who received it.
Subject: Attack/Counter-Attack?
Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 16:51:52 +0200
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charset="Windows-1252"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3 (Normal)
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997
Importance: Normal
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400
X-UIDL: 925743287.662.mercury.dnai.com
I've noted a disappointing trend of late, and was curious as to why it
has arisen. Aside from the usual attacks on our organization/philosophy,
our detractors seem to delight in ad hominem attacks on the acknowledged
leaders of the Church of Satan.
This is nothing new, but they have been increasing in frequency. Anton
LaVey naturally gets the bulk of them (as founder and long-term leader),
but we have seen a spate of attacks on our High Priestess Blanche Barton,
Online Representative (and frequent defender of our supportive members
when they are attacked) Magistra Peggy Nadramia, Magister Boyd Rice, and
also myself.
Since neither Peggy nor I assiduously keep up with this forum for
spewage, we don't follow these snipes directly, but many of you do
forward them to us. What we don't then see are forwards of your responses
to these shabby posts. When we go to look, we often don't see many
responses, if any, while the peanut gallery chimes in with a litany of
abuse that largely goes unanswered.
If the forwards are meant for us to compile a list of creeps who, if
members, will be eventually terminated--we understand. But it appears to
me that, when these comments go without response, it looks like there is
some kind of tacit approval by all of you, who are clearly seen as voices
and thus representatives of the Church of Satan (and several on the list
of folk getting this are in the Priesthood, and a number of others may
yet achieve official public spokesperson status).
To be specific: Recently we have seen "Raw Scent" (aka Audey Morgan,
"Cameobuyer," "Belphagor," etc.--overweight homosexual and eBay
shill-bidder), YRabishu (no info), and David Cromwell (a wannabee writer
who sent a crappy article to TBF and when we didn't respond soon enough
sent a snotty email claiming we were stealing his material. I responded
that he's on my shit list for this behavior [and his writing really does,
by objective criteria for such things, suck]. He has since crawled back
with an apology and has not been favored with any response.). There are
others (the variably present Paul Valentine comes to mind). If you
haven't found enough info on these creeps to do a fair-play turnabout,
I'm certain that you have enough information on the individuals being
attacked to simply point out their many achievements as a counter. Also,
the very nature of these attacks are clear signs to anyone with even a
modicum of cold-reading ability to provide ammunition for a
surgical-strike response post.
We constantly see both Blanche and Peggy being accused of being fat when
in actuality neither of these ladies is obese, simply full-figured, which
is only a crime to those who follow herd values (and something of which
homosexuals are often jealous). Any who know these ladies personally can
vouch for their command-to-look powers. They also try to couple "lazy"
with this. Gee, our High Priestess is now a widow who is also raising a
child and running an international organization (and just recently
released a bang-up issue of "The Cloven Hoof") Peggy is accused of
holding back TBF (which is really my fault as I've spent too much time on
the official website--basically a single-handed creation), when she just
released another issue of her World fantasy Award-winning magazine,
"Grue." That these people are sitting at their keyboards, contributing
nothing but vitriol and waiting like the sucking black holes they are for
our products to fill their empty lives--products which they clearly can't
live without, should be obvious and easy to point out.
So, I know that all of you lead productive and very busy lives, and that
you all know what a cistern usenet is, but since you have made a presence
there (of your own free wills you have put on the hip-waders and gas
masks) and are looked to by those who merely lurk, it would certainly
help to preserve the image of the Church of Satan as one of a den of
rattlesnakes, extremely dangerous and loyal to the death in defense of
each other (an image Dr. LaVey wanted projected) if you pointed out the
nature of these blatherings and what it demonstrates about those who post
them.
Peggy particularly has worked to promote projects by many of you--both
online and in print, and HP Barton does the same in "TCH." Anton LaVey's
laurels are there for all to see. Boyd Rice also has quite a public body
of exemplary material, and you all know something about myself, I trust.
I haven't addressed this to any individuals specifically, and many of you
haven't ignored these attacks, and responded properly. And we note these
responses and they do mean something. But lately the guard has been let
down, and the image that comes to my mind by the resounding silence is
that of those faithful awaiting the arousal of the distant Gods to strike
the utterers of blasphemy.
We aren't theists, waiting for someone else to "Make it so." As
Satanists, we must take the bull by the balls and shatter all who oppose
us. That is, if you really do respect those who are being attacked.
You are all our shock troops, our special forces, our Waffen SS, and we'd
like to see you perhaps interact with one another and coordinate your
attacks on those who dare to try to besmirch our organization, and those
of us who I think have earned your respect as your leaders.
There are some out there, like Paul Valentine, who desperately seek
attention, particularly from those whom he attacks. But you can turn his
eustress to distress when armed with the proper ammo. Come to us for the
information if you need it, but I know that you all have enough savvy and
skill to work amongst yourselves to come up with tactical responses that
would make us proud.
So, here's to swatting the flies (it may not take that much effort) so
that we can continue with all of the real business of moving the world in
our chosen directions.
Hail Satan!
Peter H. Gilmore
THIS EMAIL WAS MAILED AS BCC TO GILMORE'S LOYAL STORM TROOPERS. IT IS NOT
ASKING PEOPLE TO TEASE ANYONE ONLINE. IT IS ASKING THEM TO BE LIKE THE
WAFFEN SS, AND THE EINSATZGRUPPEN - IN OTHER WORDS, AN EXTERMINATION
SQUAD. Come to him for the information!

[Victor's Holiday Sockpuppet]

Dear Harry,

Tani seems to be correct when she claims that she and her pals forced the
COS to dump it's more fascist and extremist members. The best example is
the excommunication of a woman who advocates exterminating Mexicans and
Guatemalans (with the idea that they are "stupid people, scabs every one
of them"). Sounds like they did a great job in that particular purge, and
no doubt Jantsang was directly responsible -- just as she claims.

Post by Harry Lime
Ha! Long before you were online and *while* you were a Magistra in
good standing, in other words. Didn't make much of a fuss then, did
you Tani? The CoS took your title *away* you didn't leave voluntarily.
LOL.
Regards,
Harry Lime
www.harrylimetv.com/

*waffen ss bs chopped*

[SOD of the CoE]

50041208 viii om Hail Satan!

Tani re the work she did to compile docs on whether fascism was Satanic:
#># ...I got PAID to help find out stuff about them,

bobo:
#> by whom?
#
# Jeff - Jewish, NOT a Satanist. I don't know WHY he wanted to
# do this, I can theorize - but it's just a theory.

please do theorize. I'm curious. the ADLBB?

# didn't write the files. The COS fascist faction themselves wrote them!
# Gilmore's "be our waffen SS" super private email to "select members" was
# exposed. He's telling his members, certain ones in the "in-clique" to be
# his EINSATZGRUPPEN. What the hell do you think that means? "Go flame our
# enemies?" HA! NO. You never saw this? I'll put it below....

no idea, I'll watch for signs.

# Hey, give me a title in your org, if you have an org.

the org of which I am a member that I could do that with would be the
KISS-ASS OSCULUM-INFAME SATAN-SERVERS. to be in that you have already
to be in the Church of Euthanasia. that requires abiding by the One
Commandment (Thou Shalt Not Procreate) and paying the admission fee
($10?). then a shared initiation related to the Four Pillars (Sodomy,
Abortion, Suicide, and Cannibalism) would seal the membership (ordeal).

# ...the gang of drones that you oddly don't seem to notice on here....

can't be bothered. it would be like paying attention to the gnats on
the periphery of the windshield whilst driving through the Mohave.
there's way too much of interest elsewhere that I enjoy to bother. :>
"the gang of drones" has always been around. they just pick on new
people occasionally until the person learns how to ignore them.

blessed beast!

boboroshi at-sign satanservice.org: Satanic Outreach Director
Church of Euthanasia: http://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/
TOKUS WEBLINKS: http://dmoz.org/Bookmarks/B/boboroshi/
Ninth Scholar's Library (Satanism Archive): http://www.satanservice.org/

ps
didn't see anything attached to which you refer. I'll look again....

[Tani Jantsang]

Post by SOD of the CoE
50041208 viii om Hail Satan!
#># ...I got PAID to help find out stuff about them,
#> by whom?
#
# Jeff - Jewish, NOT a Satanist. I don't know WHY he wanted to
# do this, I can theorize - but it's just a theory.
please do theorize. I'm curious. the ADLBB?

I theorize it may have been originally instigated, perhaps, by a complaint
from Yachud - who had joned the COS and noted that many of the things LaVey
said were from Talmud and very typical of Jewish thought. He got trashed,
smashed, threatened and pretty much run out. It's just a theory. Yachud
was friendly with Jeff S Gerber - Jeff A Gerber's nephew - and both are
involved with the JTF. Jeff A Gerber - the older man I knew very well, was
IN the ADL. I theorize that what happened to Yachud MAY have instigated it.
But I have no proof and Jeff A. would NOT say one way or the other.

Post by SOD of the CoE
# didn't write the files. The COS fascist faction themselves wrote them!
# Gilmore's "be our waffen SS" super private email to "select members" was
# exposed. He's telling his members, certain ones in the "in-clique" to be
# his EINSATZGRUPPEN. What the hell do you think that means? "Go flame our
# enemies?" HA! NO. You never saw this? I'll put it below....
no idea, I'll watch for signs.
# Hey, give me a title in your org, if you have an org.
the org of which I am a member that I could do that with would be the
KISS-ASS OSCULUM-INFAME SATAN-SERVERS. to be in that you have already
to be in the Church of Euthanasia. that requires abiding by the One
Commandment (Thou Shalt Not Procreate) and paying the admission fee
($10?). then a shared initiation related to the Four Pillars (Sodomy,
Abortion, Suicide, and Cannibalism) would seal the membership (ordeal).
# ...the gang of drones that you oddly don't seem to notice on here....
can't be bothered. it would be like paying attention to the gnats on
the periphery of the windshield whilst driving through the Mohave.
there's way too much of interest elsewhere that I enjoy to bother. :>
"the gang of drones" has always been around. they just pick on new
people occasionally until the person learns how to ignore them.

:) I did post the Gilmore email on here - and I emailed you AND Cat the
post since I don't want to out these strangers AGAIN.

Post by SOD of the CoE
blessed beast!
boboroshi at-sign satanservice.org: Satanic Outreach Director
Church of Euthanasia: http://www.churchofeuthanasia.org/
TOKUS WEBLINKS: http://dmoz.org/Bookmarks/B/boboroshi/
Ninth Scholar's Library (Satanism Archive): http://www.satanservice.org/
ps
didn't see anything attached to which you refer. I'll look again....

[catherine yronwode]

Post by Tani Jantsang

#> I'm referring to the
#> issue of 'whether it is valuable/moral to kill 1 billion
#> humans and oneself without harming any other species'.
# It is not moral at all It might be valuable. It is genocide.
# Period.
depends on how it is done. the way I understood sri catyananda's
agreement to it, it wouldn't constitute genocide at all (because
she isn't going to be selecting strictly from a specific group,
like the Jews or the Kalmyks or whoever, but prefers to conceive
of it as more or less randomly or focussing more on
overpopulated regions first and thinning the herds).
corrections welcomed.

She didn't say that. So then, Africa would go, India would go,
China would go. They are highly overpopulated areas. China is
taking action about its population. Eugenics.

I referred you to former statements of mine on the subject, and did
not go into details. You have misunderstood what siva said about my
ideas, too, so i shall clarify.

I am interested in the drastic, immediate reduction of human
overpopulation. Speaking theoretically, as i have no practical means
of carrying this out, i would like to see one to five billion people
removed from this planet immediately in a painless manner. I would not
select them for any qualities. However, those who live in major
population density areas would be the best choices to go as they do
not produce their own food and their lifestyles demand greater
resources be expended than do the lifestyles of, say, low population
density farmers. Also, removing city-bound consumers would eliminate a
great deal of shipping and transport needs very quickly.

New York City would be reduced to the same population density as it
had in the 1600s -- and so would the Ruhr Valley, and Beijing, and the
Amazon rain forest, and Forestville, California.

Basically, i would like to see the population clock reset back in time
-- WITH TODAY'S TECHNOLOGY STILL IN PLACE -- and with sufficient
people around to utilize that technology. This would mean eliminating
cities, but leaving villages and towns as hub centers for distribution
of energy. Foods would be grown locally, for the most part. With so
few people, however, it might even prove feasible to ship
out-of-season food around in a limited way. Once the distribution of
energy and communication was re-stabilized, i would like to see
unlimited funding for stem cell research, cloning, and all other forms
of life extension. The ideal would be a world with a few hundred
million people all digitally connected, able to live for at least a
thousand years each.

Have you ever read "Earth Abides" by George R. Stewart? I know you are
a science fiction fan, so you might have heard of it, If not, do check
it out. It's a 1949 s-f novel about sudden human depopulation. The
problem is, Stewart's reset-point is too low (that's what drives the
novel's plot, of course; without that too-low reset-point, there
wouldn't be any almost-impossible obstacles for the protagonist to
overcome) -- but the idea is cleanly and clearly expressed there, and
it was reading this book, in combination with studying the results of
rat crowding experiments in the Scientific American magazine during
the 1950s and 60s, that got me thinking about sudden human
depopulation as an option. It helped that "Earth Abides" was written
by a friend of my mother's and was set in the East Bay, where we
lived, so the visual and verbal attention paid to the suddenly
depopulated hills of Berkeley, Albany, and El Cerrito, California made
a great impression on me.

Any further questions? Just ask!

Cordially,

cat yronwode

[Tani Jantsang]

Hi see in, sorry for misunderstandings - mostly due to procrastination
(yours). See in.

Post by catherine yronwode

Post by Tani Jantsang

#> I'm referring to the
#> issue of 'whether it is valuable/moral to kill 1 billion
#> humans and oneself without harming any other species'.
# It is not moral at all It might be valuable. It is genocide.
# Period.
depends on how it is done. the way I understood sri catyananda's
agreement to it, it wouldn't constitute genocide at all (because
she isn't going to be selecting strictly from a specific group,
like the Jews or the Kalmyks or whoever, but prefers to conceive
of it as more or less randomly or focussing more on
overpopulated regions first and thinning the herds).
corrections welcomed.

She didn't say that. So then, Africa would go, India would go,
China would go. They are highly overpopulated areas. China is
taking action about its population. Eugenics.

I referred you to former statements of mine on the subject, and did
not go into details. You have misunderstood what siva said about my
ideas, too, so i shall clarify.
I am interested in the drastic, immediate reduction of human
overpopulation.

Well, sooner or later, as I pretty much inferred on this url
http://www.geocities.com/go_darkness/god-humans-tod.html
which I will quote from in a moment, the powers that be are GOING to reduce
population. They will have to. they can't just keep the 3rd world and
developing countries where really smarter people are (like India and China
and Asia) from industrializing and having to also have access to all the
FUEL. Other sources of energy are fine and well, but as being spoken about
by a lot of experts on PBS and such, some of the fuel necessary to run a
modern society has to be liquid - and they mean GASOLINE. The Middle East
is where that is, and where a lot more resources for it are. Hence, the
"war in Iraq." Bottom line. It's not a war against Islam per se - it's a
real war over hegemony and the competition is Europe and China.

There are too many people on the planet right now. The "chemical fertilizer"
revolution only forstalled the inevitable. What about next generation?
Populations increase at the mathematical rate of "e" - unless millions are
killed off. What do you think the powers that be will DO when they HAVE to
do it? Eliminate a lot of people. Guaranteed. It's coming.

Speaking theoretically, as i have no practical means

Post by catherine yronwode
of carrying this out, i would like to see one to five billion people
removed from this planet immediately in a painless manner. I would not
select them for any qualities. However, those who live in major
population density areas would be the best choices to go as they do
not produce their own food and their lifestyles demand greater
resources be expended than do the lifestyles of, say, low population
density farmers. Also, removing city-bound consumers would eliminate a
great deal of shipping and transport needs very quickly.

I predict that the 1st world where civilization and technology exists will
not be eliminated. Backward 3rd world areas will be - and possibly there
will be some kind of war with NON-backward countries still listed as 3rd
world. Taking a look at history, this is only common sense to expect this
to happen.

Post by catherine yronwode
New York City would be reduced to the same population density as it
had in the 1600s -- and so would the Ruhr Valley, and Beijing, and the
Amazon rain forest, and Forestville, California.

Well, that's not gonna happen. But what I said might happem, will probably
happen. Who do you think really does have the MEANS to do such a thing,
Cat? Do you keep up with that kind of thing? I do. Genetics. Biological
weapons. Germs that can target a population that has a targetable trait.
Using viruses would be insane - they mutate TOO fast. Using a bacteria with
a suicide gene that comes on after it does its work would be EASY, Cat. We
have that technology right now. Point is, no matter HOW you look at it, or
go about it, it's a kind of genocide - there is no way out of that.

Post by catherine yronwode
Basically, i would like to see the population clock reset back in time
-- WITH TODAY'S TECHNOLOGY STILL IN PLACE -- and with sufficient
people around to utilize that technology. This would mean eliminating
cities, but leaving villages and towns as hub centers for distribution
of energy.

More likely it would mean, practically speaking, leaving people with high
enough intelligence to function in a civilized world and use the technology
without turning everything to shit.

Foods would be grown locally, for the most part. With so

Post by catherine yronwode
few people, however, it might even prove feasible to ship
out-of-season food around in a limited way. Once the distribution of
energy and communication was re-stabilized, i would like to see
unlimited funding for stem cell research, cloning, and all other forms
of life extension. The ideal would be a world with a few hundred
million people all digitally connected, able to live for at least a
thousand years each.

Heh, well. That's not the way cells work - and we do reproduce and have the
urge to do that for a good reason. Nature dictated that. Also, keeping the
status quo is another matter - that never seems to happen.

Post by catherine yronwode
Have you ever read "Earth Abides" by George R. Stewart? I know you are
a science fiction fan, so you might have heard of it, If not, do check
it out. It's a 1949 s-f novel about sudden human depopulation. The
problem is, Stewart's reset-point is too low (that's what drives the
novel's plot, of course; without that too-low reset-point, there
wouldn't be any almost-impossible obstacles for the protagonist to
overcome) -- but the idea is cleanly and clearly expressed there, and
it was reading this book, in combination with studying the results of
rat crowding experiments in the Scientific American magazine during
the 1950s and 60s, that got me thinking about sudden human
depopulation as an option. It helped that "Earth Abides" was written
by a friend of my mother's and was set in the East Bay, where we
lived, so the visual and verbal attention paid to the suddenly
depopulated hills of Berkeley, Albany, and El Cerrito, California made
a great impression on me.

Never read it. But in the Star Trek series where we see humans on earth
living in idealic situations in a society that isn't even driven by profit
(no longer any need for it!) - before that happened, ww3 happened and the
genetic augments war happened. 90% of humanity was wiped out before the
dream was realized. But then they got it together and set up a new kind of
society - and keep in mind you had to have intelligent and peaceful people
left to be able to do that. I'm very Roddenberrian, btw.

Post by catherine yronwode
Any further questions? Just ask!
Cordially,
cat yronwode