Tani Jantsang ©
2004-12-15 08:42:51 UTC
Clearing the Fetid Air - J. Mueller
It is specifically written for people such as Tyagi Nagasiva Boborishi
nocTifer SoD of CoE the self-proclaimed "archivist online monk," or anyone
else that claims they want to know (but actually appear to not want to
know), and for the purpose of people that repeat the same, tired questions,
appearing to want answers, who only give uninformed, uninvolved idiots that
weren't involved in any of it a reason to accuse Tani of "talking about the
god damned COS again" on some usenet newsgroup wasteland.
Up front, any court of law or detective would examine the hard core proof -
the published, in-print proof.
Therefore:
1. Let it be known that in every issue of "The Black Flame," the Church of
Satan's own official mouthpiece, Tani's and/or her group's material and
articles can be seen.
2. Let it be known that the Church of Satan wrote about all of this material
from Tani and her group as the ROOTS of Satanism, the FOUNDATIONS of
Satanism and other such astonishing, impacting words.
3. Let it be known that the Church of Satan's High Priest, Anton LaVey,
handed Tani Jantsang a honorary title of Magistra specifically for this
material. This is not the same as a Priestess; it is a lot higher. This is
also not the same as handing out a red membership card.
4. Let it be known that the Church of Satan made use of this FOUNDATIONAL
ROOTS material and tried to incorporate it, and that an entire Grotto of the
Church of Satan was based on this material. In fact, the person was handed
the Grotto and a Priesthood for this material by Anton LaVey.
5. Let it be known that this is what was ongoing since 1990 in the Church of
Satan until they were forbidden to use any of the material by Tani Jantsang
et. al. as this material is copyrighted. Copyright Registration Number TX
5-926-685, 1990, owned by Philip Marsh.
And now for the other side, offering hard proof in the form of published,
in-print material:
6. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang never once incorporated a single thing
that was of the Church of Satan or any of its members; not one single idea!
7. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang never had any USE for any of their
material or ideas!
8. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang did not consider Anton LaVey her High
Priest of any sort.
9. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang never once, at any time, put any such
title on any single thing she wrote for them, for others, or sold in the
Dark Tradition Monographs, otherwise known as the Dark Doctrines, which you
can find on our organizational website for free, or buy monographs.
10. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang was also handed two other titles in
Satanic organizations before Anton Lavey gave her one, and that one of these
organizations, The Embasat, was at odds with the Church of Satan.
11. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang held these three titles at the same
time and this was well-known to these three organizations.
12. Let it be known that these other organizations also used material from
Tani and her group and one of them, the Order of the Left Hand Path, even
represented itself as a "Dark Doctrine" organization in the published book
"Lucifer Rising."
There are hard facts, proven by published material.
Did some people imagine that the Church of Satan was the "only Satanic
organization" that represented the Dark Doctrines? Yes, some did they they
lived to regret that. The Emperor's New Religion spells that out. It is an
extensively researched essay in pdf (Adobe Reader) format. (Adobe Reader can
be downloaded for free here.)
What happened? In our view, since none of the other founders had a thing to
do with the Church of Satan and disliked them openly from the start (1960s),
nothing much happened. But for those few idiots that only know of online
matters, and who'd love to believe in fantasies, "much" happened. And so, we
will tell you exactly what happened without the guff and groaning and flames
and distractions.
Members of the Church of Satan and some few others were complaining about
being bullied by certain others in the Church of Satan, including titled
officials in the Church of Satan.
Seeing Tani Jantsang online in late 1999, they saw that she was friendly and
notably did not flame anyone that did not flame her first. They came to her
with their complaints.
Tani simply forwarded the complaints to Peter Gilmore and Peggy Nadramia and
forgot about it. These people thanked Tani for doing this. .
As things progressed, Tani learned that a few other Church of Satan members
took their complaints to Blanche Barton, who was the HP of the Church of
Satan after Mr. LaVey died. According to them, this did not go well because
Ms. Barton handed their complaints over to Peter Gilmore and Peggy Nadramia
to handle. They didn't not get handled.
Finally, Peggy Nadramia asked Tani Jantsang to get proof of this bullying
and show it to her. When Tani Jantsang set out to do this, no one behaved
like a bully when Tani was around. So Tani suggested that the COS members
that complained, and others, go get the proof themselves. Log things. Keep
emails with full headers. Etc.
After having gotten some of this, Tani handed it to Peggy Nadramia. This
resulted in Peggy getting angry with Ygraine Gidney for telling Tani about
her former trouble with Priest Schlesinger of the COS, and explaining how
Ms. Barton did nothing but hand it to Peggy Nadramia. And that resulted in
Ygraine Gidney getting angry at Tani for "betraying a confidence." What
confidence was there to be betrayed when Tani was getting this information
for Peggy to begin with?
Tired of all this rubbish, and having finished what she set out to do, Tani
decided to make her own chatroom where things would be more pleasant.
Various and sundry Church of Satan people, including Priests, Priestesses
and Magisters, went out of their way to invade this chatroom and start
fights with Tani. To which, Tani promptly told them to go to hell and kicked
them off. Who did these people think they were dealing with when they tried
to bitch at Tani for allowing members of other Satanic organizations into
her chatroom? Where did they think they even had a right to do such a thing?
What else was going on subsequent, but not related, to all of this?
Subsequent to all of this tiresome baloney, another thing happened regarding
Timothy Stewart Epperhart, a Church of Satan Active Member and member of
John Davis' "Satanic Combat Society." (John Davis is "Xloptuny," the husband
of Jacqueline Davis and a good friend of the Gidneys.)
Tim Stewart had posted a request on the "Letters To The Devil "(LttD)
bulletin board, a Church of Satan board owned by Priest Lestat Ventrue of
the Church of Satan. The request was for articles pertaining to something
Tim Stewart had heard much about: "a fascist ethic in Satanism." In fact,
Tim Stewart saw an article by Peggy Nadramia that seemed to be in favor of
this "fascist mystique." Tim Stewart simply wanted essays, since he
disagreed with the idea that fascism was identical to Satanism.
For requesting essays, Tim Stewart got abused and threatened and told to
read "Mein Kampf," Adolf Hitler's book. Tim Stewart got the clear idea that
there was a fascist faction within the Church of Satan itself. We believe
that had Tim Stewart paid closer attention to articles in "The Black Flame,"
the Church of Satan's official newsletter, he'd have had no doubt about
that. Had Tim Stewart known a thing about Jeffrey DeBoo, he'd also have
known about it. Jeffrey DeBoo may as well be seen as the "anti fascist watch
dog" in Satanism.
Tim Stewart next posted these requests and some preliminary first draft
essays on the usenet newsgroup alt.satanism. He got no responses on there
from anyone. .
Tim Stewart next came to the chatroom Tani and her friends made and
requested essays. He did get responses and he got essays from many people.
Happy with that, Tim Stewart asked or paid for a website to be made for his
essays, which collection he entitled, "Project One." That was done.
Ygraine Gidney and her friends decided to concern themselves with Tim
Stewart's excellent idea. They harassed him about it. They finally went to
Peter Gilmore about it and got him to take a look at Tim Stewart's
collection of essays.
That resulted in Tim Stewart getting a threatening letter from Peter Gilmore
that, for some odd reason, included Tani Jantsang and Dark Doctrines. It is
strange because nowhere in any of the essays Tim Stewart collected, and
nowhere in sight was there any mention of Dark Doctrines. He simply has his
opening preface, a statement, and some essays. He was terrified by what
Peter Gilmore wrote him and he took the collection of essays down. In his
cowardice, he told Gilmore that Tani had helped him get the essays! True,
Tani did do that. But Tim Stewart had this ongoing project long before he
ever mentioned it to Tani.
We at the SR are not so lightly intimidated by anyone over such matters. The
entire collection can be seen as "Is Fascism Satanic" on the SR website. All
of it makes for a very interesting read, since many viewpoints are shown on
there, both pro and con.
Meanwhile, some of these people on Ygraine Gidney's side against Tim
Stewart, decided to take this squabble online to the usenet group known as
alt.satanism and drag Tani Jantsang into it. They prattled on about how
Anton Lavey specifically told them that, "the Church of Satan is a
dictatorship."
Tani Jantsang, for the first time in her life, used the Magistra title in
her responses to these people - she trashed them, flamed them, tore them to
shreds. Then Tani printed out all of it and sent it personally to Blanche
Barton.
Of course, Ms. Barton wrote back to Tani, hurt, confused, she felt deceived
and used, and took the Magistra title away from Tani.
Let us have a look at this. Did Ms. Barton take anything away from Tani that
Tani used? NO. Published material proves this.
Tani, on the other hand, told the Church of Satan that they no longer had
any permission to use a single word, sentence, paragraph or idea from the
Dark Tradition Monographs (Dark Doctrines).
Let us have a look at this: Was that taking something away that the Church
of Satan did use? YES. Published material proves this.
After all that happened, fans of the Church of Satan tried to insist that
this disentitlement meant something to Tani. They can spin their wheels all
they wish, but the hard core, published material proves this is just not the
case.
After all that happened, fans of the Church of Satan would like to claim
that Ms. Barton was conning Tani. As The Barton Letters show, this is just
not the case at all. These were put up to show "proof" when people inventing
the fabrications asked for proof.
Now, this happened around 2000. It is now 2004 and the fans of the Church of
Satan, and anyone they can get to help them, are still bothering Tani on
usenet wastelands such as alt.satanism. They distort events, misquote what
she said, try to doctor it up any which way, they even try to deny the proof
they themselves gave Tani showing that officials, such as Priest Rex Church,
in the Church of Satan claimed, on radio, that the Church of Satan was,
indeed, a fascist organization.
These people obviously have a strongly vested interest in trying to change
what actually happened, or confusing other people with the timing of these
events. They feel the need to waste their time, now going on four years
doing this (2004). They use libel about person and property, as if that
matters. They out personal matters, as if that matters. They lie about the
personal information, too, as if that matters. They take Tani's photographs
and deface them, turning beautiful images into pornographic images, as if
that matters. They will state a completely fabricated falsehood of their own
making, and then proceed to treat that fabrication as if it is the truth.
And so forth. If Tani wastes her time flaming them back, or correcting their
errors, she is then immediately accused of talking about the Church of
Satan. These people are clearly obsessed people, a whole gang of them, that
thrive on old squabbles and like to sling mud around, as if in their attempt
to sling mud at Tani, they can change the facts.
It would seem to any objective observer that the Church of Satan is quite
angry that the Satanic Reds - and Tani in particular, shut them out and
closed the door on them, even trashing them and helping others to compile
"CoS Files" to rip them to shreds. Keep in mind, that the CoS Files were
written by people in the CoS itself, not by Tani or any of us! It would
seem to any objective observer that they are very angry that the SR
organization exists, is doing fine, and has absolutely no roots in their
club or in the mouthings of Anton LaVey, no use for any of their stuff, and
does not ever use any of their stuff. They realistically should be happy
about that. But they aren't.
Tani did a little bit more than just print out and mail all of the trash
about the Church of Satan's members to Ms. Barton? It seems that Tani did a
wee bit more than just that. She also handed all of that and more, much
offline hard copy material, to one Jeffrey A. Gerber to give to the people
that requested this information: THE ADL of the B'NAI B'RITH. Mr. Gerber
paid Tani for her time.
Why would Tani do that when, prior to that, she didn't care much about
intra-organizational squabbles or even know any of these people involved?
One very simple reason: they invaded her turf and dared to try to tell her
what to do, who to talk to, who not to talk to, and so forth. They also
asked her for help. When she gave them the help they asked for, they turned
on her because they realized that the "bullying" they complained about came
straight from the top. That is what they did. That is a declaration of war.
(Why Mr. Gerber did what he did is not our concern. He was not an SR member
or a Satanist. Mr. Gerber was a Freemason and a Jew.)
There is nothing more to this. Anyone looking for more is simply looking for
dirt.
These are the objective, provable, published facts. We fail to see what more
needs to be said. Nothing more needs to be said.
If anyone wishes more information about any of this, they can find it on
"Unfortunate Necessary Statements."
Anyone that relies on squabbles that started offline, went to private mails,
phone or emails, and then, finally and maybe, spilled over onto usenet or
chatrooms in bits and pieces, is a certifiable moron.
Anyone that relies on outsiders, especially uninformed and uninvolved
outsiders, for inside information is a certifiable moron.
Anyone that relies on a self-proclaimed online monk's "usenet archives"
instead of going to the various organizations or independents for the
information about these organizations or individuals, first hand, is a
certifiable moron. If you want to know what I think, ask me. Do not ask my
brother, my friend, my parents or my enemies. Do not ask Tani or Vad or any
other founder of this organization. Ask me. If you do otherwise, then you
prove that you do not want to know.
In my personal opinion only, anyone that even bothers handing such
information over to "curious outsiders" when the information about these
organizations is to be found within the organizations, is wasting their good
time. Nine times out of ten the "curious outsider" does not want to know,
does not want to do the research needed to know and will most likely indulge
in an argument without even carefully reading what he has been handed. He
most likely has an agenda, whether he realizes it or not.
--
Satanic Reds - Dark Tradition, Sat & Tan
Frames: http://satanicreds.says.it
Bookmark http://www.geocities.com/satanicreds
Michelet Satanism and Witchcraft http://home.wi.rr.com/lylythdotorg/
Dark Doctrines www.apodion.com/vad/
Guardians of Darkness http://geocities.com/go_darkness/index.html
Cthulhu Mythos:
http://.innsmouth.rules.it
http://lovecraft.shows.it
"Life is a wonder to be lived; not a problem to be solved."
-- TJ
It is specifically written for people such as Tyagi Nagasiva Boborishi
nocTifer SoD of CoE the self-proclaimed "archivist online monk," or anyone
else that claims they want to know (but actually appear to not want to
know), and for the purpose of people that repeat the same, tired questions,
appearing to want answers, who only give uninformed, uninvolved idiots that
weren't involved in any of it a reason to accuse Tani of "talking about the
god damned COS again" on some usenet newsgroup wasteland.
Up front, any court of law or detective would examine the hard core proof -
the published, in-print proof.
Therefore:
1. Let it be known that in every issue of "The Black Flame," the Church of
Satan's own official mouthpiece, Tani's and/or her group's material and
articles can be seen.
2. Let it be known that the Church of Satan wrote about all of this material
from Tani and her group as the ROOTS of Satanism, the FOUNDATIONS of
Satanism and other such astonishing, impacting words.
3. Let it be known that the Church of Satan's High Priest, Anton LaVey,
handed Tani Jantsang a honorary title of Magistra specifically for this
material. This is not the same as a Priestess; it is a lot higher. This is
also not the same as handing out a red membership card.
4. Let it be known that the Church of Satan made use of this FOUNDATIONAL
ROOTS material and tried to incorporate it, and that an entire Grotto of the
Church of Satan was based on this material. In fact, the person was handed
the Grotto and a Priesthood for this material by Anton LaVey.
5. Let it be known that this is what was ongoing since 1990 in the Church of
Satan until they were forbidden to use any of the material by Tani Jantsang
et. al. as this material is copyrighted. Copyright Registration Number TX
5-926-685, 1990, owned by Philip Marsh.
And now for the other side, offering hard proof in the form of published,
in-print material:
6. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang never once incorporated a single thing
that was of the Church of Satan or any of its members; not one single idea!
7. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang never had any USE for any of their
material or ideas!
8. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang did not consider Anton LaVey her High
Priest of any sort.
9. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang never once, at any time, put any such
title on any single thing she wrote for them, for others, or sold in the
Dark Tradition Monographs, otherwise known as the Dark Doctrines, which you
can find on our organizational website for free, or buy monographs.
10. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang was also handed two other titles in
Satanic organizations before Anton Lavey gave her one, and that one of these
organizations, The Embasat, was at odds with the Church of Satan.
11. Let it be known that Tani Jantsang held these three titles at the same
time and this was well-known to these three organizations.
12. Let it be known that these other organizations also used material from
Tani and her group and one of them, the Order of the Left Hand Path, even
represented itself as a "Dark Doctrine" organization in the published book
"Lucifer Rising."
There are hard facts, proven by published material.
Did some people imagine that the Church of Satan was the "only Satanic
organization" that represented the Dark Doctrines? Yes, some did they they
lived to regret that. The Emperor's New Religion spells that out. It is an
extensively researched essay in pdf (Adobe Reader) format. (Adobe Reader can
be downloaded for free here.)
What happened? In our view, since none of the other founders had a thing to
do with the Church of Satan and disliked them openly from the start (1960s),
nothing much happened. But for those few idiots that only know of online
matters, and who'd love to believe in fantasies, "much" happened. And so, we
will tell you exactly what happened without the guff and groaning and flames
and distractions.
Members of the Church of Satan and some few others were complaining about
being bullied by certain others in the Church of Satan, including titled
officials in the Church of Satan.
Seeing Tani Jantsang online in late 1999, they saw that she was friendly and
notably did not flame anyone that did not flame her first. They came to her
with their complaints.
Tani simply forwarded the complaints to Peter Gilmore and Peggy Nadramia and
forgot about it. These people thanked Tani for doing this. .
As things progressed, Tani learned that a few other Church of Satan members
took their complaints to Blanche Barton, who was the HP of the Church of
Satan after Mr. LaVey died. According to them, this did not go well because
Ms. Barton handed their complaints over to Peter Gilmore and Peggy Nadramia
to handle. They didn't not get handled.
Finally, Peggy Nadramia asked Tani Jantsang to get proof of this bullying
and show it to her. When Tani Jantsang set out to do this, no one behaved
like a bully when Tani was around. So Tani suggested that the COS members
that complained, and others, go get the proof themselves. Log things. Keep
emails with full headers. Etc.
After having gotten some of this, Tani handed it to Peggy Nadramia. This
resulted in Peggy getting angry with Ygraine Gidney for telling Tani about
her former trouble with Priest Schlesinger of the COS, and explaining how
Ms. Barton did nothing but hand it to Peggy Nadramia. And that resulted in
Ygraine Gidney getting angry at Tani for "betraying a confidence." What
confidence was there to be betrayed when Tani was getting this information
for Peggy to begin with?
Tired of all this rubbish, and having finished what she set out to do, Tani
decided to make her own chatroom where things would be more pleasant.
Various and sundry Church of Satan people, including Priests, Priestesses
and Magisters, went out of their way to invade this chatroom and start
fights with Tani. To which, Tani promptly told them to go to hell and kicked
them off. Who did these people think they were dealing with when they tried
to bitch at Tani for allowing members of other Satanic organizations into
her chatroom? Where did they think they even had a right to do such a thing?
What else was going on subsequent, but not related, to all of this?
Subsequent to all of this tiresome baloney, another thing happened regarding
Timothy Stewart Epperhart, a Church of Satan Active Member and member of
John Davis' "Satanic Combat Society." (John Davis is "Xloptuny," the husband
of Jacqueline Davis and a good friend of the Gidneys.)
Tim Stewart had posted a request on the "Letters To The Devil "(LttD)
bulletin board, a Church of Satan board owned by Priest Lestat Ventrue of
the Church of Satan. The request was for articles pertaining to something
Tim Stewart had heard much about: "a fascist ethic in Satanism." In fact,
Tim Stewart saw an article by Peggy Nadramia that seemed to be in favor of
this "fascist mystique." Tim Stewart simply wanted essays, since he
disagreed with the idea that fascism was identical to Satanism.
For requesting essays, Tim Stewart got abused and threatened and told to
read "Mein Kampf," Adolf Hitler's book. Tim Stewart got the clear idea that
there was a fascist faction within the Church of Satan itself. We believe
that had Tim Stewart paid closer attention to articles in "The Black Flame,"
the Church of Satan's official newsletter, he'd have had no doubt about
that. Had Tim Stewart known a thing about Jeffrey DeBoo, he'd also have
known about it. Jeffrey DeBoo may as well be seen as the "anti fascist watch
dog" in Satanism.
Tim Stewart next posted these requests and some preliminary first draft
essays on the usenet newsgroup alt.satanism. He got no responses on there
from anyone. .
Tim Stewart next came to the chatroom Tani and her friends made and
requested essays. He did get responses and he got essays from many people.
Happy with that, Tim Stewart asked or paid for a website to be made for his
essays, which collection he entitled, "Project One." That was done.
Ygraine Gidney and her friends decided to concern themselves with Tim
Stewart's excellent idea. They harassed him about it. They finally went to
Peter Gilmore about it and got him to take a look at Tim Stewart's
collection of essays.
That resulted in Tim Stewart getting a threatening letter from Peter Gilmore
that, for some odd reason, included Tani Jantsang and Dark Doctrines. It is
strange because nowhere in any of the essays Tim Stewart collected, and
nowhere in sight was there any mention of Dark Doctrines. He simply has his
opening preface, a statement, and some essays. He was terrified by what
Peter Gilmore wrote him and he took the collection of essays down. In his
cowardice, he told Gilmore that Tani had helped him get the essays! True,
Tani did do that. But Tim Stewart had this ongoing project long before he
ever mentioned it to Tani.
We at the SR are not so lightly intimidated by anyone over such matters. The
entire collection can be seen as "Is Fascism Satanic" on the SR website. All
of it makes for a very interesting read, since many viewpoints are shown on
there, both pro and con.
Meanwhile, some of these people on Ygraine Gidney's side against Tim
Stewart, decided to take this squabble online to the usenet group known as
alt.satanism and drag Tani Jantsang into it. They prattled on about how
Anton Lavey specifically told them that, "the Church of Satan is a
dictatorship."
Tani Jantsang, for the first time in her life, used the Magistra title in
her responses to these people - she trashed them, flamed them, tore them to
shreds. Then Tani printed out all of it and sent it personally to Blanche
Barton.
Of course, Ms. Barton wrote back to Tani, hurt, confused, she felt deceived
and used, and took the Magistra title away from Tani.
Let us have a look at this. Did Ms. Barton take anything away from Tani that
Tani used? NO. Published material proves this.
Tani, on the other hand, told the Church of Satan that they no longer had
any permission to use a single word, sentence, paragraph or idea from the
Dark Tradition Monographs (Dark Doctrines).
Let us have a look at this: Was that taking something away that the Church
of Satan did use? YES. Published material proves this.
After all that happened, fans of the Church of Satan tried to insist that
this disentitlement meant something to Tani. They can spin their wheels all
they wish, but the hard core, published material proves this is just not the
case.
After all that happened, fans of the Church of Satan would like to claim
that Ms. Barton was conning Tani. As The Barton Letters show, this is just
not the case at all. These were put up to show "proof" when people inventing
the fabrications asked for proof.
Now, this happened around 2000. It is now 2004 and the fans of the Church of
Satan, and anyone they can get to help them, are still bothering Tani on
usenet wastelands such as alt.satanism. They distort events, misquote what
she said, try to doctor it up any which way, they even try to deny the proof
they themselves gave Tani showing that officials, such as Priest Rex Church,
in the Church of Satan claimed, on radio, that the Church of Satan was,
indeed, a fascist organization.
These people obviously have a strongly vested interest in trying to change
what actually happened, or confusing other people with the timing of these
events. They feel the need to waste their time, now going on four years
doing this (2004). They use libel about person and property, as if that
matters. They out personal matters, as if that matters. They lie about the
personal information, too, as if that matters. They take Tani's photographs
and deface them, turning beautiful images into pornographic images, as if
that matters. They will state a completely fabricated falsehood of their own
making, and then proceed to treat that fabrication as if it is the truth.
And so forth. If Tani wastes her time flaming them back, or correcting their
errors, she is then immediately accused of talking about the Church of
Satan. These people are clearly obsessed people, a whole gang of them, that
thrive on old squabbles and like to sling mud around, as if in their attempt
to sling mud at Tani, they can change the facts.
It would seem to any objective observer that the Church of Satan is quite
angry that the Satanic Reds - and Tani in particular, shut them out and
closed the door on them, even trashing them and helping others to compile
"CoS Files" to rip them to shreds. Keep in mind, that the CoS Files were
written by people in the CoS itself, not by Tani or any of us! It would
seem to any objective observer that they are very angry that the SR
organization exists, is doing fine, and has absolutely no roots in their
club or in the mouthings of Anton LaVey, no use for any of their stuff, and
does not ever use any of their stuff. They realistically should be happy
about that. But they aren't.
Tani did a little bit more than just print out and mail all of the trash
about the Church of Satan's members to Ms. Barton? It seems that Tani did a
wee bit more than just that. She also handed all of that and more, much
offline hard copy material, to one Jeffrey A. Gerber to give to the people
that requested this information: THE ADL of the B'NAI B'RITH. Mr. Gerber
paid Tani for her time.
Why would Tani do that when, prior to that, she didn't care much about
intra-organizational squabbles or even know any of these people involved?
One very simple reason: they invaded her turf and dared to try to tell her
what to do, who to talk to, who not to talk to, and so forth. They also
asked her for help. When she gave them the help they asked for, they turned
on her because they realized that the "bullying" they complained about came
straight from the top. That is what they did. That is a declaration of war.
(Why Mr. Gerber did what he did is not our concern. He was not an SR member
or a Satanist. Mr. Gerber was a Freemason and a Jew.)
There is nothing more to this. Anyone looking for more is simply looking for
dirt.
These are the objective, provable, published facts. We fail to see what more
needs to be said. Nothing more needs to be said.
If anyone wishes more information about any of this, they can find it on
"Unfortunate Necessary Statements."
Anyone that relies on squabbles that started offline, went to private mails,
phone or emails, and then, finally and maybe, spilled over onto usenet or
chatrooms in bits and pieces, is a certifiable moron.
Anyone that relies on outsiders, especially uninformed and uninvolved
outsiders, for inside information is a certifiable moron.
Anyone that relies on a self-proclaimed online monk's "usenet archives"
instead of going to the various organizations or independents for the
information about these organizations or individuals, first hand, is a
certifiable moron. If you want to know what I think, ask me. Do not ask my
brother, my friend, my parents or my enemies. Do not ask Tani or Vad or any
other founder of this organization. Ask me. If you do otherwise, then you
prove that you do not want to know.
In my personal opinion only, anyone that even bothers handing such
information over to "curious outsiders" when the information about these
organizations is to be found within the organizations, is wasting their good
time. Nine times out of ten the "curious outsider" does not want to know,
does not want to do the research needed to know and will most likely indulge
in an argument without even carefully reading what he has been handed. He
most likely has an agenda, whether he realizes it or not.
--
Satanic Reds - Dark Tradition, Sat & Tan
Frames: http://satanicreds.says.it
Bookmark http://www.geocities.com/satanicreds
Michelet Satanism and Witchcraft http://home.wi.rr.com/lylythdotorg/
Dark Doctrines www.apodion.com/vad/
Guardians of Darkness http://geocities.com/go_darkness/index.html
Cthulhu Mythos:
http://.innsmouth.rules.it
http://lovecraft.shows.it
"Life is a wonder to be lived; not a problem to be solved."
-- TJ